Beginner PHP Code Contest

Hi all,

I'm a beginner to PHP and these contests are a bit outside my experience. I'm still learning by viewing the code of the winning entries.

Would it be possible to post a beginner's PHP coding contest? It could either:

o Run along side the existing contest.
o Alternate the current contest with a beginner contest
o Make the current contest a week longer and have a week long beginner contest in the middle so that judging wouldn't be the same time as the current contest.

I would even be willing to help organize/judge if need be.

Have a great day!

Will
will.at.thewholeclan.com

Will,

I have thought of doing this, but there is one problem as I see it. What is to stop someone that is a PHP expert from coming in and cleaning house? I would really like to post some challenges for the PHP newbies, but I can't figure out how to get around this...

being a beginner myself i like the challenge. however, i have a problem with being motivated to code anything i don't find useful. i'd like to see future contests offering scripts we can use in the "real" world

One way is that you already know who's submitted to your previous contests.

The other way would be to not offer prizes. This would be just a "who can do this the best" kind of contest. Or something similar. Do you follow where I'm going?

I think that if I can code to win your current contest then I should win prizes because those are really indepth contests.

I really wouldn't mind making a page on my site that says, "Look what i've won at Codewalkers Beginning PHP contest" .... just recognition is all I would be wanting.

Also, you/we could post everyone's results somehow and we could probably tell who the "experts" are.

Finally, the only real way is to have it be on an honor system. ie: "If you are an experienced coder please do not enter this contest", etc.

Will

a mystery prize might be interesting.. so long as it isn't a tootsie roll pop.

then again i'm not here to help or win prizes, just here to code but dang that zend 2.5 looks.. no! i'm not about material things.

I really would like to create a contest for beginners. I will think long and hard about the best way to implement it. If anyone has any suggestions, please let me know!

The prize worth/value should be proportional to the contest difficulty.

Say T-shirt for beginners, Studio for experts, etc.

Everybody really needs some kind of skill ranking. Guess that means everyone that enters would have to become a member so they would have a profile of some sort.

Maybe like an online test or exam to try and find out what knowledge the person has. Not acurrate, but feasible at least.

Experts should be able to enter the newbie contest but exempt themselves from winning or from the prizes.

This is a great idea. I also like the one about registering. dunno how it would work, but it's a good idea.

well, a couple of things : experts wouldn't want to be known as newbies, i don't think...

... and what a blow it would be if a newbie actually beat you.. hmm..

also, how do you define "newbie"? i mean, there is so much i still have to learn about php it makes me feel like a newbie even though i've got almost 2 years behind the belt.

another thing, is newbie considered php-newbie or coding newbie? someone could have been coding in c/c++ for years and only found php a week ago.. they still newbie?

Can you tell from the coding style that a person is newbie or not? if not you could just ask people to tell you that they're newbies.. Then you could always just give "honorable mention" to the best between the newbies in a contest?

My 2c.

Matt,

what about setting up something between CodeWalker and PHP Beginner? You could use our network of beginner and me your experience!

Meanwhile, all of you ... List us some ideas on how to prevent the experts getting into beginner contests?

Maxim maletsky
Founder, Chief Developer
PHPBeginner.com

I've been dreaming some things up on how this could be done. I could still use any suggestions any one has...

Maxim...we'll be in touch on that one

I'm probably not going to be liked for this response, but here goes.

Contests are good for generating interest in new solutions.

Contests used for generating motivation for learning generally fail to teach anything other than bad habits.

Programming is more than just putting nuts and bolts together.

Any monkey can put a bunch of nuts and bolts together.

But to put together a constellation of nuts and bolts that fulfill a particular purpose that is elegant and well-designed and can stand the test of time - that requires more thought and creativity - it's more a combination of art and science.

And not even rocket science.

Motivating new programmers to learn by giving them contests gives them a false sense of superiority over their peers, when what they really need is a healthy amount of guidance and freedom to create without the added stress of deadlines.

AND someone to teach good habits and good design.

Learning is not all self-imposed. Otherwise, we'd've had a whole bunch of Einstein's and Socrates and Platos running around w/o a need for an education system.

I for one think there are other avenues for encouraging beginner/newbie programmers in PHP without resorting to contests.

I would suggest tutorials based on the previous contests showing why the design was good/bad or what could have been improved.

Analysing previous code with the help of a mentor I feel would be much more productive since it would give the new programmers the tools needed to succeed, not just to hang some certificate on their wall.

And once they were good enough, the general contests would become available to them and THAT should be the motivation that drives.

The urge to excel in the eyes of one's peers, moreso than the urge to be recognized for wanting to succeed.

My two cents.

You may all agree or disagree.

I just spend too much time fixing bugs from people that skipped all the theory and went straight into coding figuring as long as it worked, it must be good.

The fact that I don't ever see an end to my work should say something about what happens when you skip the boring steps and go straight to the exciting stuff. That and the stuff I've written is still running to date.

Anyway. Gotta jet.

Shamim Islam
passionplay@hotmail.com

Please - no nasty grams. If you have something civil to say, feel free to share. Otherwise, just bite the bullet and show me what you're made of in the current and future contests.

Thanks much in advance.

Shamim,

I would agree with you for the most part. I like the idea of having lessons that reach a usable goal. I'm going through some tutorials now on building a CMS for my own website. I know I could use other CMS but where would the learning be?

That said, I like contests because, at least in my case, the force me to think outside the box. Also, the contest designer may come up with a problem that I may never get a chance to solve. And through solving it I may be able to add some tricks to my book or be able to use the solution in other project.

Bottom line - I agree with you Shamim mostly. I also like contests

Will
will.at.thewholeclan.com

Wouldnt you kind of be able to tell?? I mean an expert would have absolute AMAZING code that was efficiently written and all if that, a beginner, well, would just be not as good... DO you get what I am syaing, no offense to beginners, I am still fairly beginning, and I can tell the difference between my code and some of the contest winners code,,,

then maybe there are experts out there who still consider themselves beginners considering there's an endless amount of information to actually learn..

i say just make up some printable/unalterable(PDF) contracts for people to print off and send in, and if you find out that they lied then you can sue.